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NORS.org

Posted: Tue Dec 01, 2009 11:51 am
by Ken G
NORS.org has changed their name. Actually, they changed the name of their site. Typing in NORS.org no longer works.

Use this instead: http://www.nationalrivers.org/

Same info.

I highly recommend that over the winter, everyone take the time to read through everything on this site. There is a reason I've been exploring all the little nooks and crannies of local rivers. Some say I'm trespassing, I simply tell them I'm following Federal Law when it comes to stream access. It takes precedence over State Law.

There is an effort underway to more or less define these access rights based on State Law. That is the wrong approach. This is giving credence to the fact that the state is violating federal laws by limiting public access. This can't be allowed to happen. The National Rivers website suggests educating people to what the federal law is. Read the site through so you know what that is.

If you want to read how I've summarized it so far, go here: viewforum.php?f=45

And I've pointed this out before and I will finally be getting in touch with NORS to clarify it. This looks like an extremely important point that gets overlooked:
The information on http://www.nationalrivers.org/ is a summary of federal laws regarding access to primarily any kind of flowing water. It's main focus is access for canoes and kayaks and any other thing you can float down a stream with. They touch on fishing, camping, hiking and other outdoors activities, but their main focus is float access.

In that long first part I put up, which I first read over 5 years ago and have read numerous times since, there is one small paragraph that I must have skimmed over all these years. For some reason I must have been reading it slower and it finally sank in.

Fishermen may have even more access rights to flowing water than anyone else. Here's the paragraph I kept missing.
First, the public has the right to use all running waters, (even streams that are not physically navigable,) for activities such as fishing, (subject to state regulations to conserve fisheries,) and to walk along the banks as necessary to use these waters, in the manner that is least intrusive to private land.
This means Wisconsin's access laws are just the federal laws in practice. I fished a couple of streams in Wisconsin that there was no way you could float anything down them, but fishing them wasn't bad and access was easy.

So, that means all those tiny creeks that you can't float down are still fair game to a wading fisherman. I've always done this anyway, but apparently there are legal precedents. I'm not just being stubborn. (Okay, maybe a little.) A couple of examples on the Fox would be Hollenbeck and Morgan creeks. There is no way you can float anything but popsicle stick boats down these, but I know that at certain times of year, there are plenty of small fishable holes going pretty far upstream from their mouths.

There are plenty more creeks like these on the Fox, and probably hundreds of them through out the state.

Illinois wouldn't even have to really do anything. The federal laws are already there and take precedent over pretty much anything the state can do. All Illinois has to do is follow the federal laws.

That goes back to my snide comment in the first part of these posts. DuPage County voted to allow wading in water that runs through forest preserve land. Since it was illegal for them to ban wading there in the first place, gee thanks for giving back what was rightfully mine to begin with.

Education seems to be the key. When I find the time, I'll think of some way to do it.
In what little spare time I have lately, I think I'm going to concentrate on getting this stuff clarified. I first started doing that 8 or 9 years ago when I first heard of NORS. It's time to finish the job.

Re: NORS.org

Posted: Tue Dec 01, 2009 9:51 pm
by twade
That is a lot information.. i'll need to find a moment to read it.

Re: NORS.org

Posted: Tue Dec 01, 2009 11:27 pm
by Ken G
Now you know what I used to do when I had the time.
The Illinois statutes is the one I kind of read through, but never really read it to understand it.

Some day. I'm determined to get this clarified, or be a bit of a pain in the ass to get it rolling. :)

Re: NORS.org

Posted: Wed Dec 02, 2009 9:46 am
by Rob P
Who can we find to get the shocking survey data for the Illinois River?

They do many locations 2x a year.
I'd like to work on the Dresden, Marseilles, Starved Rock pool data..

Re: NORS.org

Posted: Wed Dec 02, 2009 12:36 pm
by Ken G
Rob,
Contact Dale Bowman, he'll know exactly who you can talk to.
I would have to get in touch with Bob Rung or Steve Pescitelli to find out.

Years ago a friend got me fishing the Illinois. Whatever pool that the Fox drains into. Apparently in that dam to dam stretch the IDNR estimated 1 BILLION white bass. Every time we hooked one I had to conceal the fight and avoid bringing the fish over the side of the boat so no one would see them.

DUH, didn't you just tell me there a friggin BILLION of these things in this stretch?????

Heaven forbid they GET THIS SPOT. We may never find another white bass. :P :P :o :o :( :( :? :?

Re: NORS.org

Posted: Wed Dec 02, 2009 12:51 pm
by Special Ed
lmao!

I bet there are that many smallies in almost every dam to dam stretch of the Fox river.

The NORS site has been a good source of info for me. Lots of gobbledy gook to sort through, but a great research site.

Re: NORS.org

Posted: Wed Dec 02, 2009 9:45 pm
by Rob P
Fox dumps in at Ottawa, thats considered the Marseilles pool (below the Marseilles Dam).
We spend a lot of time in the summer in Seneca/Marseilles but above that dam on the Dresden pool.

Fishing is so so and much better further west, but i have seen asian carp jumping.
Thanks.
I'll email Dale and i'd love to spend time with that data set.

Thats the scientist/fisherman talking..

Re: NORS.org

Posted: Wed Dec 02, 2009 10:20 pm
by Ken G
Rob,
Let us know what you get. I'm curious if there actually is a billion white bass in there.
I'd settle for a million.