Sam's flathead rod...

[Special Ed]

Hey Ed- if you're out there - what's the feasibility of building a very strong version of this telescoping rod for flatheads? If not telescoping, something ferruled that I could snap together...

-SB

Strength? How strong are we talking? 10lb test is strong for river bass fisherman. I have a feeling you mean 20lb+ line strength. Probably not going to find anything shy of a surf fishing outfit in that kind of strength.

If anything is available it will probably be JDM and quite pricey.

I can tool around the surf fishing products to see if I can find a crossover if you give me some specs.

Rod length, line wt, lure weight, how many pieces?

[heysambennett]

Hey Ed-

It'd be a 16' rod, no reel seat, just a single line tie at the tip. It'd need some backbone, but also some bend at the tip. 30 lb. braid is probably what I'd want to rig.

I'd like it to break down into four 4' sections.

The objective is to be able to dangle a 4-5" bluegill on a 1-3 oz drop shot rig right in the boil at the dams.

The problem that I'm trying to solve is that when casting bluegills into the boil and using a 3 oz no roll sinker with a 6" leader, the baits get beat to hell on the rocks, or end up getting cast into the face of the dam, and die.

If I could dip a bait right in the boil I can keep them healthy longer. I expect I'd like it to be able to handle a 45 lb flathead. At least a 30 pounder.

You don't want the tip too stiff, you'd need to be able to play them.

-SB

[Special Ed]

16' in 4 pc sections will be tough to find but I'll look around.

You do realize that with that much rod length on the fish's side that you will have no leverage against this fish right? Especially if its a big cat.

I'll still see what I can find.

[heysambennett]

Hey Ed-

Thanks for moving the post over here. I started blabbing in kind of a silly spot.

My plan is to keep a good bit of the rod behind me, under my arm, so I'll really be fishing about 12'. I have no idea if this is even a feasible way to try and catch a flathead, to be honest. But it is something I've been thinking about for a few years.

4 pieces isn't a hard requirement. Nothing is a hard requirement, other than getting the functionality of being able to gently dip a bait in the boil, from a distance of about 10-12'. It makes me nervous to get any closer than that to the face of a dam.

I've even considered a 20' section of PVC pipe, and I'd fight the fish by pulling the pipe backwards hand-over-hand like a rope. I'd go longer since it's probably going to bend at any diameter that'd be workable. My plan was to balance it on my shoulder.

I even considered building a big tripod for that PVC rig, so I can more easily control the contraption without breaking my back.

I've considered heavy tent poles, aluminum tubing...

Last year I used balloons to float the baits, keeping them just off the bottom, but they came out of the boil too fast. I need 'em to really sit in there for a while. The more you cast the baits the more chance you have of them dying.

What would you do? Just give up fishing the dams for flats, like I mostly have?

Help me Obi-Ed-Kenobi, you're my only hope. (Otherwise, if you see some jackass fishing with tent poles, yep, that'll probably be me.)

-SB

[Special Ed]

Looking quickly for item/value I came up with the following:

IM7 Euro Carp blank 13', 2pc. rated Med/Hvy 17 to 25lb line, weighing a paltry 8.5oz. - $100 (just for the blank)

Heavy wall fiberglass 12', 2pc. rated Heavy 20-40lb line, weight ? (probably over 20oz.) - $30 (just for the blank) 2' extension available for $20.

If you'd like to look at spey/switch rods in the 15'+ lengths we would be talking about $300+ blanks. If that's the way you want to go let me know.

Otherwise those two options up there are about all I can come up with.


Building it would be minimal expense of course. Probably some super thin lightweight grip material... maybe cork tape, a tip guide, and maybe a couple line tie-offs so you can spool your line on the rod.

[heysambennett]

Well, Ed, you seemed somewhat skeptical about fighting a fish on this type of setup.

What do you think? Would taking the cheap-o route with the 2' extension be the way to start and see if it'll work? I'm definitely priced out at $300. Can't justify trying it with a reasonable chance it won't work very well anyhow.

I'd leave it up to you to work your magic the best way you see fit on the customization.

-SB

[Nick]

The euros land some biiiiig carp on set ups like these all the time. I would imagine that it would work fine for flatties. The main difference is that they often use reels.

Other euro rods are very very long and are without reels but those are mostly used for brim (bluegill).

[Special Ed]

Well, Ed, you seemed somewhat skeptical about fighting a fish on this type of setup.

What do you think? Would taking the cheap-o route with the 2' extension be the way to start and see if it'll work? I'm definitely priced out at $300. Can't justify trying it with a reasonable chance it won't work very well anyhow.

I'd leave it up to you to work your magic the best way you see fit on the customization.

-SB

I can't make the $/worth it decision for you as I have no idea what kind of disposable income you have. For the heavy glass rod, if you figure, parts, labor, tax, and shipping you're looking at close to $100. This rod will be heavy, and totally experimental.

My biggest question is will it be able to be held out at 10'-12' for an extended period of time? Probably not.

So... I'm thinking with a sling to put some of that weight on your shoulder, and a counterweight added to the rear of the rod you might be in business. You're probably also going to want a tether so that when a 30/40/50+lb cat tries to tear off downstream it doesn't leave you empty handed.

If the $100 ballpark sounds acceptable, let's do it. I'd also like to be included on equipment testing on the water if you don't mind. This concept is downright bitchin' if you ask me and I'd love to see it in action.

Shoot me an email at: ed@fourseasonangler.com to get the details hammered out.

[heysambennett]

Hey Ed-

Let's do it. Expect an email tomorrow. (The river calls.) I think this experiment will be a lot of fun. Once Ken shows me those flathead holes, maybe we could test it down there? I have a feeling this is going to be a version 1 prototype. To get it just right is going to take some hacking - but I think once it's dialed in it will be a really neat rod to have in your back pocket.

I got the 16' Wonderpole yesterday and took it for a test drive. A few observations that might relate to this build:

I can place baits quite exactly. I got a SM dipping the backside of boulders. The dam is too wicked to wade to test the optimal length. After fishing it, I'm not sure I want this setup purely to fish the dam anymore. This is a stealth setup. This and my canoe could be a lot of fun.

Takes some getting used to. Walking the rod/line into place, rather than adjusting the angle of the rod seemed to work best.

The point where the whole setup is weakest is when you're pulling straight back inline with the rod. I might use heavier line than I normally fish. With only 6-16' of line to work with (and the bend of the pole being the main fighting component) a bigger fish could snap off fast if you don't react and get straightened out.

I'm going to adjust my behavior to sweep back low to the water rather than set the hook vertically.

The grips are in the wrong place. Even with this lighter model the thing is heavy. Grips should be at least 2'-3' forward so the back of the rod acts as a counterbalance. A true counterbalance wouldn't fix this, you still need 2' of rod behind you, but adding a counterbalance would improve the design greatly. If possible, a design where we could add or remove weight to get it dialed would be cool.

Getting the right amount of line on this thing is going to vary based on what and how I'm fishing. Bring along the spool.

Overall it was great to fish the Fox with the Wonderpole. It's not going to replace my spinning gear, by any means, but it is something I plan to utilize quite a bit this season.

With a heavier model I agree Ed - a sling is probably in order. You just can't hold that much rod out there for very long. (Well, I can't) The counterbalance will help a lot. The key is getting it balanced under your arm.

I'm going to get back out and fish it in different types of water. It's obviously good for dipping baits around structure, so I'm going to see how it handles swimming lures in current. I'm also going to add more line to it and see how that works. Yesterday I only had about 8' of line on it. I should be able to handle 14-16'.

-SB